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Society’s Reaction to the Loss of Lifetime Employment and Lifetime Marriage
During the 1990’s, Western Civilization went through two radical, irreversible transformations. These societal upheavals were so significant that future historians will likely pinpoint the 1990’s as the social and economic turning point of the Western world (or at a minimum, the second greatest turning point after the 1960’s).
-By Caleb Jones
1. Lifetime Employment
2. Lifetime Marriage
The loss of these two conditions is fascinating history, but what’s even more interesting, at least to me, is the radically different ways in which society reacted to these two losses.
How Society Reacted to the Loss of Lifetime Employment
It’s amazing how fast people forget how things were just a few decades ago. Prior to the 1990’s, and for most of the 19th and 20th Centuries (if not longer), when you got a job as a young man out of school, you more or less stayed at that job, or at least stayed at that company, for your entire working lifetime.
You got your job as a young man, worked at that firm for 40 years, then retired. They gave you a gold watch and a pension that was virtually guaranteed income for the rest of your golden years, and then you reached the average age of life expectancy and died. Things like job interviews, resumes, and job searches were barely relevant and not nearly as integral as you and I consider them today. Once you got a job, you were pretty much set. I realize there were exceptions to that rule, but they were the exceptions.
I was born into this world. My dad was raised in this world. I relay the story in my book about how my dad was utterly confused that I was making all the money I was making as a very young man, even though I never had a job on my resume that was longer than about 18 months. In his world, a world that no longer existed, you got a job and were more or less set for life, or at least for a very long time. If you worked at a job for just a few years, it looked “bad” on your resume and no one in their right mind would want to hire you.
Nothing lasts forever though, and things change. With every decade, government grew, and grew, and grew. Regulations increased. Taxes went higher and higher. (Tax rates eventually decreased, particularly for the rich, but the actual mount of taxes paid by the typical family increased, and increased dramatically.) America went off the gold standard and started printing money, crashing the purchasing power of the dollar. Inflation increased. On and on this went.
Finally, after decades of this, during the early 1990’s, regulations on business and employers became so expensive and difficult that companies discovered they could save literally billions of dollars by shipping their jobs overseas to third-world workers.And so they did. The free market reacted to changing government conditions, as it always does.
For those of you who are my age or older, you remember what happened. Millions of people were instantly laid off from their jobs. Blue collar workers who had worked at their companies for over 20 years suddenly found themselves not only jobless, but with skills companies no longer wanted.
All over the country, the news screamed a new word: “downsizing.” Corporate downsizing was the greatest news story for years. Millions were furious as the West converted from a manufacturing economy to an information-based economy. People screamed. People cried. People committed suicide. It was very hard for everyone.
Yet, about ten years later, by the early to mid-2000’s, society adjusted. People emotionally accepted that lifetime employment was gone and was never coming back. They accepted that the company you worked for could no longer be trusted to be loyal to you, and would likely fire you or lay you off the instant they didn’t need you anymore.
People learned new skills. Blue collar guys grudgingly became HTML guys. People who never before gave a shit about their resumes polished them off and made new ones. People went back to school to learn new skills.
Society said, “It really sucks that I can’t rely on a long-term job anymore, but okay, if that’s the way it is, I’ll adjust and make do so I can feed my family.”
Today, in the 2010’s, no one even thinks about this anymore. Everyone knows that when you get a job, you’ll be there for just a few years (at best!) before you need to find a new one. It’s become the new normal that everyone has accepted.
Now let’s look at the other thing society lost in the 1990’s, and how people reacted to that...
How Society Reacted to the Loss of Lifetime Marriage
Cultural pressure to stay married no matter what was immense. Even men who tried to divorce their wives would get laughed out of court by the judge who would say, “What? You’re trying to divorce your wife? You can’t do that! Get out of here and get back to your family! Next case!”
Moreover, most women were unable to support themselves financially due to cultural reasons, so if you were a woman who actually got divorced, you were in very big trouble. So married women just stayed married, even if they hated their husbands, which they often did.
Then came the Sexual Revolution of the 1960’s and second wave feminism of the 1970’s, and things started to change. Slowly, women started to detach from husbands and set their own paths. Slowly, courts started letting people get divorced more liberally. Slowly, religions became more accepting about people getting divorced.
My dad was one of the statistical exceptions. In the mid-60’s, he got divorced from his first wife. Today, damn near everyone over the age of 30 has been divorced, but back then, a middle-aged divorced man was a pariah. When he tried to marry my mom, her Catholic family was horrified. “You can’t marry a divorced man! That’s disgusting!” The intolerance against divorced people was so intense that my parents almost didn’t get married. (Fortunately, they did and created me, or else you wouldn’t be reading this blog right now.)
However, over time, as more and more people started getting divorced, even the most conservative people in my mom’s family started accepting my dad as “normal.”
So, in the 60’s, the divorce rate increased for the first time ever. In the 70’s, it increased again. In the 80’s it really shot up, but was still not as prevalent as it is today. When I was a kid back in the 80’s, there were always one or two kids in my classroom who had divorced parents, so it was a normal and understood thing, but there was just one or two of these kids in the class. Today, almost all the kids in the classroom have either divorced parents or never-married mothers.
By the 1990’s, marriage had reached a breaking point. The divorce rate in many cities in the US and Europe went north of 60%. Lifetime marriage was now officially a thing of the past unless you were an exception to the rule.
Since then, the divorce rate has grown even worse. I’m not talking about the overall divorce rate, which is a ratio of marriages to divorces in any given year, or per capita divorce rate, which is the number of divorced per capita. These numbers have actually gone down since less people are getting married. I’m taking about the divorce rate among people who actually get married, which now hovers somewhere around a staggering 70%, and is still rising. (Feel free to read the stats I lay out here if you think that number is not correct, or at least not close.)
How did society react to all this?
The answer is... they didn’t. Other than getting divorced more often, they didn’t change their behaviors much at all. The divorce rate kept climbing and climbing, but people still got traditionally married in droves anyway. The cheating rates kept climbing and climbing, but people still got monogamous anyway.
When warned not to get traditionally married, people said, Fuck you! That won’t happen to me! I know what I’m doing (said the men). We’re really in love (said the women). I’m not stupid. You’re just being negative! And then they got married. And then they got divorced.
And the divorce rate continued to climb.
Men got divorce raped left and right. Men had their children torn from them. Men lost their homes and their retirements. Many men were sent to jail because they couldn’t afford their child support or alimony payments.
And men kept getting married anyways... and kept recommending marriage to others.
Women got cheated on left and right. They got divorced, and many of them couldn’t receive child support because their deadbeat husbands didn’t make enough money, got under-the-table jobs, or moved far away. The economic status of the typical mother plummeted. Women filed bankruptcy. Women became depressed. Children suffered. Millions of women went on welfare, food stamps, and “disability.” Millions more went on anti-depressant medication. They spent their entire lives cursing their ex-husbands and living in financial lack. The average happiness of adult women plummeted; the studies and surveys clearly showed it.
And women kept getting married anyways... and kept recommending marriage to others.
And the divorce rate continued to climb.
Society emotionally accepted the loss of lifetime employment. Yet, even though we’re almost into the 2020’s, to this day society still has not accepted the loss of lifetime marriage. While people are waiting a little longer to get married today, they’re still getting long-term monogamous, still getting legally, traditionally married, and still expecting it to work.
I’m not saying they eventually didn’t react at all. People in their 20’s are avoiding marriage, that’s true, but according to the census data, the number of unmarried people suddenly plummets as soon as they hit their 30’s. People aren’t saying no to marriage. They’re just waiting a little longer, getting married in their 30’s, and then getting divorced.
Many people are now embracing serial marriage, where they get monogamous, legally married (with no prenup), and plan on getting divorced anyways. Yet even these people are the exceptions. The vast majority of people who engage in TMM (traditional monogamous marriage) actually expect it to last forever, base all their future plans around it, and are shocked and furious when it doesn’t last forever. And it usually doesn’t. So, one huge shift society accepted within a quick, ten-year time span (lifetime employment going away), but another huge shift (lifetime marriage going away) society still refuses to accept after 25 years.
Isn’t that interesting?
This won’t last forever, of course. Eventually, and it might take another decade or two, normal, everyday, Societally Programmed people are going to finally have to admit that traditional marriage doesn’t work anymore and that men should probably look at one of the other eight options for relationships. Until that day, more people will get divorced, more men will be financially raped, more women will be cheated on, and more children will get screwed up. Sometimes we are slow to learn.
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CSR 2017-03-09 06:21:48
The key is, as it usually happens, lack of information. The example you give of the job situation is easier to understand because it doesn't involve feelings, sex, etc. It's a "thing", it's about money, it's just "data". But when it comes to relationships it gets complicated. It's 2017 and let's face it, men still have absolutely no clue about how women work. Their basic attitudes, their sexual strategy, what they want in a relationship, etc. Most of them don't know it, a few of them know it but don't accept it because the truth is very, very ugly and only a tiny, tiny handful of them are, well, red pill aware. And from that tiny group, most of them have already suffered the consequences of the ultra liberated sexual market we live in today (divorce raping, etc.). Another problem is the State. It absolutely benefits women no matter the situation and that's one of the reasons women still push for the standard traditional marriage. They know they'll win, specially if there are kids involved. Custody, alimony, etc. Almost guaranteed. Societal Programming/Feminism. We know how that works. Manipulation and lies up to massive scales making men believe women work literally the opposite of what they do. Then it's women's sexual strategy. Because they tend to be serial monogamists, "monogamous" marriage or LTRs almost fit with what they need. If they lose attraction for the guy they just branch swing to the next. The only one truly suffering for not having sex with someone else is the man from the first minute. Of course after several years she'll get bored too but again, she'll just branch swing. And linked with the lack of information: guy's neediness. They just accept whatever she says because she's their only way to get sex (we know it's false but beta/neediness behavior works like this). And that affects at least 80% of the heterosexual male population. And that's way, way more difficult to understand for the masses.
AL 2017-03-09 06:24:23
Interesting post. I suppose perhaps that the difference is that to put food on the table, people had to work, so there had to be an attitude change. Whereas, somehow, marriage is divorced (pun intended) from reality so there hasn't been an attitude change. But it will come. I look forward to seeing the ramifications.
joelsuf 2017-03-09 06:40:21
America went off the gold standard and started printing moneyOne of, if not THE worst thing that the US has done ever. I wonder if BD thinks the same, sometimes I feel like I'm alone when I say that the US should get back on the gold standard. Meh, I guess we have cryptocurrencies now I suppose.
joelsuf 2017-03-09 06:51:09
people are going to finally have to admit that traditional marriage doesn’t work anymore and that men should probably look at one of the other eight options for relationships.I actually kinda disagree with this. People want pair-bonding, and will continue to believe that being married is the ONLY way to accomplish pair-bonding. With lifetime employment, there isn't as much emotional investment as there is with marriage. Also consider the observation that top 40 music, which pretty much has become a form of SP, still straight up LECTURES both sexes to catch feelings and get stupid one-itis. And I say this because SP is also telling people that the opposite sex's opinion of you is now MORE relevant than what you do for a living.
Tony 2017-03-09 07:02:59
This will start to shift as more women start to earn more money than their husbands and suddenly they're the ones who have to pay alimony and child support. Women complain about their problems much more loudly than men do, so when more of them get screwed in divorce suddenly marriage won't sound like such a great idea.
CSR 2017-03-09 07:19:21
Very unlikely. Women tend to choose the easiest careers/job paths so they will probably earn less money for the years to come. In fact, with the advent of automatization, lots and lots of easy/auxiliary/"pen pusher" jobs will disappear in favor of Alexa and the like.
Tony 2017-03-09 07:26:39
Childless women in their 20's already make more on average than childless men in their 20's. A lot of these women will marry men making less than them. And of course they'll get divorced. In 10 years we'll suddenly see a large increase in the number of women paying their ex husbands after a divorce, and weirdly these absurd alimony and child support payments will be the hot new issue.
Duke 2017-03-09 07:35:15
Women don't marry men that make less than them. Hypergamy remember?
Tony 2017-03-09 07:46:05
There are plenty of women who marry guys making less than them. They may prefer it if he makes more, but they are willing to settle in order to get married.
CrabRangoon 2017-03-09 08:03:13
Great article BD. It still amazes me how many very intelligent people I know still think TMM with no prenup is a swell idea and will last forever. I also know some very high sex drive guys that have gone TMM and they now damn well they'll be cheating on their wives before long. They have never been able to do monogamy but keep trying like fools. I hope you're right about people coming around in 10-20 years but I have my doubts. People are very emotion based in their decision making nowadays, such as how politics have become in recent times. It'll be very tough for the masses to give up this delusion and say it aloud. Secretly, as you've stated, many know that they'll probably get divorced down the road but would never admit it to their families, friends, etc...
Marsupial 2017-03-09 08:12:50
A big change over the past 80 years has been about religion. Christianity in the west. Not only are their fewer religious people, churches have become keen to serve the feminine imperative. Why? Because women have money, now. As men become less and less likely to donate to a religion, it leaves churches with little choice. The most glaring feature, the litmus-test for this, is Mt 5:32. This is not some 11th-century bishop, or some monor prophet in the OT, this is Jesus himself saying that any marriage with a divorced woman is nothing but adultery. Unrepentant adulterers, of course, go to hell. Pretty much no-one seriously believes this anymore, and they really did used to. Christianity used to take seriously the job of restraining serial monogamy - a females preferred mating strategy - and that role used to have a real, positive effect. And now it simply doesn't. Why is this so important? Because it's fathers that socialise children into their societal roles. Monyhan's quote rings truer and truer every year:
From the wild Irish slums of the 19th century Eastern seaboard, to the riot-torn suburbs of Los Angeles, there is one unmistakable lesson in American history; a community that allows a large number of men to grow up in broken families, dominated by women, never acquiring any stable relationship to male authority, never acquiring any set of rational expectations about the future -- that community asks for and gets chaos. Crime, violence, unrest, disorder -- most particularly the furious, unrestrained lashing out at the whole social structure -- that is not only to be expected; it is very near to inevitable. And it is richly deserved.
Joanna 2017-03-09 08:45:49
Yup people keep recommending traditional marriage to me all the time, apparently I am missing out but I don't think so based on what I see and hear. Last weekend I was at a friends wedding and they got married in community of property... Yikes I almost choked. (This is good for her since he is a foreigner with lots of dough) Fun wedding though, they were popping magnum bottles of Moet like peas which felt like daggers going into my chest since a bottle costs thousands in my currency *shudder* Another reason sited for traditional marriages is I will benefit from 2 incomes so I can buy a home at a retarded interest rate for 20 years ...immediately refinance it to do upgrades because the magazine show on TV says I must. Urgh what a fucking shit way to increase my so called income...it would be safer in my humble opinion for me to play Russian Roulette or to join a pyramid scheme.
Lars 2017-03-09 09:13:12
BD, one of your best blog posts ever. I'm a 58 year old guy who's lived thru this, and been totally screwed over by my refusal to accept the new reality of relationships. That's going to change.
Gil Galad 2017-03-09 09:43:46
I suppose perhaps that the difference is that to put food on the table, people had to work, so there had to be an attitude change. Whereas, somehow, marriage is divorced (pun intended) from reality so there hasn’t been an attitude change.That's exactly what I was gonna say. People will not abandon a comforting myth just because "logic" or even high degrees of discomfort, but they will abandon it if it is demonstrably threatening to take away their bread. As simple as that. As Orwell brilliantly put it in 1984: "In philosophy, or religion, or ethics, or politics, two and two might make five, but when one was designing a gun or an aeroplane they had to make four".
Blackdragon 2017-03-09 11:11:45
But when it comes to relationships it gets complicated. It’s 2017 and let’s face it, men still have absolutely no clue about how women work. Their basic attitudes, their sexual strategy, what they want in a relationship, etc. Most of them don’t know it, a few of them know it but don’t accept it because the truth is very, very ugly and only a tiny, tiny handful of them are, well, red pill aware.When every man, even clueless betas, constantly see men all around them men get divorced, dumped, cheated on, and/or divorce raped, I no longer consider that an excuse. Your excuse was for men back in the 80's or prior, not men today.
Another problem is the State. It absolutely benefits women no matter the situation and that’s one of the reasons women still push for the standard traditional marriage.Correct. Men can still say no. And they're not. As I've said many times, this is on men. Women aren't going to change this, since they have no motivation to do so.
I hope you’re right about people coming around in 10-20 years but I have my doubts. People are very emotion based in their decision making nowadays, such as how politics have become in recent times.Good point, and yes, I could be wrong on that. People today, on the left and the right, are indeed more insane and irrational than I've ever seen them in my lifetime (and I'm 44). This situation may just get worse "forever," or close to it. Is it 2025 yet?
CSR 2017-03-09 11:44:07
When every man, even clueless betas, constantly see men all around them men get divorced, dumped, cheated on, and/or divorce raped, I no longer consider that an excuse. Your excuse was for men back in the 80’s or prior, not men today.They fall into the "she's different than the rest" or "that won't happen to me" traps. And that's because they don't know how women work. One thing is to recognize the divorce disaster and a very different thing is to know how women work. When you know both is when you quickly realize things, specially AWALT and avoid oneities . If not, it's very easy to see the divorce disaster as something circumstantial, because you still don't see how the sexual/relationship market works as a whole. If men already knew these, then it would be true that the excuse wouldn't make sense post 80s. Just think about your own marriage. It was way after the eighties. Would you have done it if you've had all the information back in the day?
Lars 2017-03-09 12:06:17
I think another reason that it's harder for society to come to grips with the failure of Lifetime Marriage is that it's been around for hundreds of years, if not longer. The idea of Lifetime Employment has only been around for maybe 125 years. The idea wasn't as entrenched in Societal Programming as is Lifetime Marriage. But the evidence of failure of Lifetime Marriage keeps piling up. New research shows that old advantage of married people having more sex on average -- that advantage is quickly disappearing: http://wapo.st/2mnSjob
Michael Adkison 2017-03-09 12:10:53
And what are today's children learning about their upcoming life"
Blackdragon 2017-03-09 12:10:56
They fall into the “she’s different than the rest” or “that won’t happen to me” traps. And that’s because they don’t know how women work. One thing is to recognize the divorce disaster and a very different thing is to know how women work.Hm. I don't have rebuttal to that. Good point.
If men already knew these, then it would be true that the excuse wouldn’t make sense post 80s. Just think about your own marriage. It was way after the eighties. Would you have done it if you’ve had all the information back in the day?Yes, I would have. I would have just moved in with her, not gotten married, had my same two kids, and she would have moved out amicably about three years later instead of angrily nine years later. But I admit I'm an exception to the rule, and most betas (like I was back then) would have just proceeded anyway, so I think your point is a valid one.
CrabRangoon 2017-03-09 12:42:21
@Lars "New research shows that old advantage of married people having more sex on average — that advantage is quickly disappearing" This is nothing new-that's an old myth that married people have more sex. I don't know any long term married couple that has frequent sex. Even in other LTR's, the sex wanes over time-people just get bored. It's biological for women and men like variety. They tend to compare a typical single person to a married person as well which skews the results. Newly married people probably have more sex, just like new couples but that doesn't last. And then when you're wife won't fuck you anymore, you have no other option other than rubbing one out to porn. Having abundance with at least an FB on the side in an Open LTR will really change the dynamic in your favor.
Joe K 2017-03-09 14:11:24
RE: CSR vs. BD 'debate' - It may be 'on men' as BD says, here in the year 2017, but men are part of the 'conspiracy' too... Chances are, if you're like me - your mother, your father, your brother(s), your sister(s), close male friends, close female friends - they all hold NAWALT ideology far dearer to their hearts than, say...YOU, as a human being. Men are now socialized to believe that no matter what happened that resulted in the broken marriage, it was somehow their responsibility. There must've been something they did 'wrong'. They must've failed in some way. They must not have been sufficient in some way that they should've anticipated/been prepared for/known how to overcome. BD - from your comment, I'm guessing that at least WRT men you've looked up to / been close to in life - they were rare good examples in terms of the wisdom they've passed along. Men like me were inundated from a young age with absolute bullshit propaganda from the people we trusted most. Therefore, men like me have to hit rock bottom (even though I was never technically divorced) and fundamentally alter the way we view everyone we once trusted - before we can tear ourselves away from the TMM paradigm. I think CSR wins this 'debate' for the reasons I stated...but BD - I have an observation tangential to this that might make a great future column: I've noticed at least a half-dozen instances in the past few months where a group of women (all older and/or lower SMV) have zeroed in on me while out at a bar/club...One woman approaches and says that I should dance with/talk to her friend across the room/at their table bc she thinks I'm attractive and bc it's this woman's birthday/she's newly divorced/she's celebrating X, Y, or Z (sometimes that's coupled with an offer to buy me a drink if I comply). Now - even with the non-courageous proxy approach strategy - once this invitation has been thrown out there, the expectation is almost assumed that I ought to at least approach and talk to that interested-in-me woman. Anyone who notices or overhears this proxy request - it's as though I *should* comply with the request. (FWIW, sometimes I do, sometimes I don't). It's almost like SP dictates 'you owe it to that woman over there to pay her the time of day, even though she didn't approach you directly'.... OK, now reverse the genders, reverse the SMV...replay that scenario accordingly. What does SP dictate now?
Blackdragon 2017-03-09 15:19:56
New research shows that old advantage of married people having more sex on average — that advantage is quickly disappearingAs Crab already said, it's bullshit. Those few studies that show "married people have more sex," and I've only seen two in all of my research (usually sponsored by biased Christian organizations), even those show, once you dig into their numbers, that it's married people in their 20's who have more sex. Even these studies show that married people 30 over have less sex than unmarried people. That's because, of course, your marriage is new when you're in your twenties, and that's the only time in your marriage when you have a lot of sex. Once your marriage gets past the three year mark, you're done with the frequent sex (unless you two are a very rare exception to the rule).
BD – from your comment, I’m guessing that at least WRT men you’ve looked up to / been close to in life – they were rare good examples in terms of the wisdom they’ve passed along. Men like me were inundated from a young age with absolute bullshit propaganda from the people we trusted most.Incorrect. 100% of the men in my life back when I was a 25 year-old beta were the typical guys; pro-marriage betas or pro-marriage Alpha 1.0's. I just knew, even when I was a young beta, that the divorce rate back then in the mid-90's was so fucking high that getting married was a big risk. I was also a little leery of monogamy ever since I was a teenager; in high school I had no idea why the guys I knew who had girlfriends bothered. "Dude... you're in fucking high school... there are women everywhere! Why the hell do you have a girlfriend?" I never had a girlfriend until I was 24 years old, by choice. I made fun of guys with girlfriends. The only reason I got traditionally married way back then was because I wanted kids, and I was unaware of any other options to do this (like OLTR marriage, swinger marriage, etc). There was no Blackdragon or manosphere back then, and there was barely even an internet. I was on my own. Today's men don't have that excuse. But I agree that CSR has a good point; men self-delude despite knowing all the data.
I think CSR wins this ‘debate’ for the reasons I statedThere is no debate. I agreed with CSR's point. What I say still stands though; women have NO motivation to change any of this and never will, so if it's going to change, it's going to have to change with men. And yes, men may be so pussified (in the case of betas) or delusional / brainwashed (in the case of pro-Disney Alpha Male 1.0's) today that the problem may never be fixed. Yet another reason why Western civilization is in such big trouble.
GD HF 2017-03-09 16:08:25
"Society emotionally accepted the loss of lifetime employment. Yet, even though we’re almost into the 2020’s, to this day society still has not accepted the loss of lifetime marriage. While people are waiting a little longer to get married today, they’re still getting long-term monogamous, still getting legally, traditionally married, and still expecting it to work."The learning time is a function of media involvement, both the intensity and direction of it, or in other words programming. The inacceptable changes in the job market were... well, advertised as even positive, with careful extensive programming. There are no interests promoting the dismission of marriage, so it's not being programmed into the collective mind. They can go on a hundred years still believing contrary to what they say, until the programming doesn't change. And I am not sure that's bad. One thing I find fault with your reasonings is... for you, average and low intelligence people don't exist: they aren't part of your mental world. They aren't part of your "let everybody free, quit all programming!" merrisome world 🙂 But it's those people the ones who become destructive for both society and themselves without the programmed marriage doctrine. It's already happening, for reasons we know and don't need to outline, to a specific fraction of the population. So, they aren't telling people the truth because they don't have an effective work-around.
Blackdragon 2017-03-09 17:26:24
There are no interests promoting the dismission of marriage, so it’s not being programmed into the collective mind.A very good point. I think that's accurate.
And I am not sure that’s bad.Rampant cheating and historically high divorce and screwed up kids aren't bad?
One thing I find fault with your reasonings is… for you, average and low intelligence people don’t exist: they aren’t part of your mental world. They aren’t part of your “let everybody free, quit all programming!” merrisome world But it’s those people the ones who become destructive for both society and themselves without the programmed marriage doctrine.If the SP was "dumb people should get married," that would be one thing and we could have that discussion, but that's not what the SP is and I've never heard anyone say this. Instead, the SP is this: EVERYONE should get married! And if you don't, you're immature/selfish/jaded/shallow/loser/sex addict/nihilist/sinner/whatever, and it doesn't matter if the real divorce rate is 70% and the marriage satisfaction rate is 60% and the government takes your money and your kids away during a divorce, just do it anyway you asshole! That's what I have a problem with. And you should too.
joelsuf 2017-03-09 18:13:55
Instead, the SP is this: EVERYONE should get married!I'd like to add that EVERYONE should go to college! Is another part of SP, and society has reacted to College being irrelevant in the development of a person's intellect in the same, or even a worse way than marriage.
This will start to shift as more women start to earn more money than their husbands and suddenly they’re the ones who have to pay alimony and child support. Women complain about their problems much more loudly than men do, so when more of them get screwed in divorce suddenly marriage won’t sound like such a great idea.I'm inclined to agree, but chicks are MUCH more cognizant and self aware of this kind of thing than dudes. They'll know how to approach that line without actually crossing it. This is why they enjoy serial monogamy. BD has written a couple of articles about this that explain better than I can. Absolute power does indeed corrupt absolutely, but that doesn't mean the corruption can be controlled to a certain degree. Chicks have been able to effectively do this for decades now.
Mayrick Dubois 2017-03-09 18:39:22
BD, great article and right on with both points. Like you, I was born into the system of lifetime employment. It was my father's and grandfather's system and that was all we knew. People our age, were the first generation that experienced that system break down right when we were getting into the workforce and secondary education. We had to quickly learn to adapt. We were graduating college learning that the job security previous generations had would not be in our future. However, everyone had to adapt no matter the age, so they could survive. Society has accepted the change and are continuing to change to the new normal of employment. In regards to lifetime marriage, I do think we will see socialital changes in the future for the concept of marriage. I think the concept of non momagouus options will increasing become more discussed and accepted. As you mentioned, divorce was not accepted by society until later in the 20th century. Now divorce and serial monogamy are mostly accepted by society. As people start to learn and realize that there are other options to monogamy they will start to increase choosing non monogamy. Of course, not everyone will because some will hold onto SP. It will probably be a gradually fading out of the dominance of monogamy over many years.
KryptoKate 2017-03-09 18:51:02
Lol, I remember when my parents divorced in the late 80s, I was put in this class called "banana splits" with all the other kids in my elementary school whose parents weren't married, which was basically therapy because the school was afraid we were all damaged for life. And there were only like 10 of us in the entire K-5 elementary school and we were all deeply ashamed. I had friends whose parents wouldn't let them come over to my house to play because my parents were divorced and it was so scandalous. Nowadays there are kids whose family relationships are so complicated it requires a chart because both their parents are on their 2nd or 3rd marriage and they had kids in each so they have siblings, step-siblings, half-siblings, ex-step-siblings, step-parents, ex-step-parents. Seriously, it can get complicated pretty fast. I agree with Tony about younger people and the shift with women making money. When I look at the couples I know who are in their 20s or early 30s, the man doesn't make more money in ANY of those couples. That formation really seems to be something for those age 35+. Also totally agree with GD HF about media programming and also low and average IQ people. I used to think that irrational religious beliefs and superstitions should and would be abolished in the future, but now I fear that because I've realized that dumb people really NEED the structure and the rules. Kind of like how I used to think that professional sports and the amount of time, attention, and money poured into them was moronic...but now I am quite happy about it as I am fairly certain that men being distracted by the sublimated warfare of sports is the only thing keeping them from engaging in real warfare. And agree with Joelsurf about college too. I can't even believe people think everyone should be going to college when it's perfectly obvious than maybe only about 10% of people have the intellectual interest and capacity to make it anything other than a total waste of time and money. And big shocker that once you make something that was once incredibly scarce and unusual -- a college degree -- completely common with everyone earning one, that it would become totally worthless as well. The problem with all these things is that they are somewhat like ponzi schemes in that the people who are already bought in to the systems really need for everyone else to continue to buy in or they collapse. The higher education system and all the associated industries (student loans, etc) is now so enormous it's one of our biggest industries and we really can't reform the system without millions of people losing their jobs. Marriage works best for those who are already married if everyone else gets married too. If there are lots of single people running around, it's too much temptation and one's opportunity costs with settling down are much higher.
CurtsNOKC 2017-03-09 20:10:51
I always follow the money and so I would propose that the reason people still get married is due to the ADVERTISEMENT industry around marriage: - dresses, diamonds, wedding planning, honeymoon planning, clothes, by a new house, etc. - then divorce attorneys wld eventually lose $ too. That's the part I wld really like to see. But the other secondary issue might be: What in the fuck will mommies teach their girls to be and do when they grow up? What in the fuck will women talk about at work? So, it's $ and Gossip or a show and tell for chics to compare who has the biggest ring lol. At 41, I see these young guys on Facebook w their wife holding up their huge diamond ring and I just wanna slap these guys. Basically, Traditional Marriage in the USA has become THE biggest scam in the world (maybe aside from the IRS income tax) and people are totally oblivious to it.
Don_Quibollox 2017-03-09 20:23:34
CurtsNOKC beat me to it: Follow the money! Marriage is big business. It aligns perfectly with the needs of capital. Job 'flexibility' and zero hours contracts etc also align perfectly with the needs of capital.
POB 2017-03-10 07:11:35
Yep, there's a gazillion dollar industry behind traditional marriage. People are making heaps of money from this outdated and failed system!!! Another reason why "society" won't fix it soon (if ever). Also a divorced young guy or girl is just a potential repeat costumer. Why care about divorce rates, broken families, single moms or fucked-up kids when the profits go up? Traditional marriage is slowly looking like socialism. Same arguments over and over again because it's never the systems "fault"....it's just that "people don't get it how to implement it properly in the real world". Yeah, ok.
CrabRangoon 2017-03-10 08:56:34
@POB and CurtsNOKC Dang totally forgot about the money!!!! There is so much money to be made from weddings and divorce nowadays. Just saw some short documentary on youtube about a divorce lawyer who lives like a fucking rock star, driving exotic cars and acting like some pimp rapper making it rain. It's pretty disgusting but there you have it. Just look at a magazine rack-I once counted 20 different bridal magazines. This is why I don't see people giving up on this fantasy any time soon.
CurtsNOKC 2017-03-10 09:24:35
Yeah it's funny cuz when marriage or monogomy comes up, I enjoy fucking w the ladies so I always act really chill and say I'm totally cool w all that maybe some day as long as we have a an Annual Renewal Date.?. They look at me like I'm nuts and I just keep a straight face for as long as I can lol. Man they just think your a complete asshole and unromantic now lmbo.
Fred Flange in a deep state 2017-03-10 17:50:02
Here is the Atlantic agreeing with you: https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2017/03/manufacturing-marriage-family/518280/ When men can't get jobs, due to trade shocks, marriage plummets. Women don't want to marry jobless losers. But they'll have kids with them. Out of wedlock births are now 41%. Maybe this phenomenon will force men to wake up. They can't be sold on marriage by the SP if the SP also says you aren't marriageable without beta bucks.
Dimwit 2017-03-10 18:52:03
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_the_United_States Hey BD you like statistics. If you look at wiki page, you will find that most people in the United States are... Agnostic? Nope Atheist? Nope Without religion? Nope again. Nearly 70% are Christian. Bingo! What did that Catholic school of yours teach about lifetime job? Anything at all? Except sloth being a mortal sin... What about tmm? Bingo! Any surprises there tmm SP is so strong?
joelsuf 2017-03-11 03:16:07
What about tmm? Bingo! Any surprises there tmm SP is so strong?Only it isn't just religion. Put on any Top 40 radio station, and see if you can get to five songs without hearing a song about some boy who is proud of having one itis or some chick who is ready to keep her man. There's TONS more SP that pressures others to have stupid TMMs. The State (and especially democratic socialist states like the US) rely on it. So of course its gonna be pushed. I'm just sad that BD didn't address how society hasn't dealt with the loss of college guaranteeing anyone a job and how THAT is still pushed on everyone even though college will actually hold one back even more than not going to college nowadays.
Dimwit 2017-03-11 05:24:19
Yes, currently about 5% of marriages are non-monogamous. Of those, only 1/3 of that 5% are non-monogamous marriages between 2 straight people, 2/3 of them are with bisexual people. Some are open, some are swingers, some are Mormons. Bisexuals are allowed to fuck their own sex on the side. Religion is here to stay, and this SP is not going away. As for lifetime employment being gone, America is fucked and is in crisis since 1990-s. It still rides on the fact that US dollar is the global reserve currency it can print to buy goods from China. At some point the world may say "enough" to that. We have a fucked up currency and financial system run by software engineers and wrong models that require Periodic near death experiences like 2008 and huge bailouts. The future of such Keynesian Economy is a complete reset like Greece... People better have strong families and lots of land to rely on or they will be fucked. Yes, land, not gold. You can't eat gold. People WILL be fucked, and in case of Greece coming to USA I expect lots of gun violence, the country will become unsafe. Economic reset is not behind us, it is still coming because it is the Achilles heel of Keynesian economy, which digs itself out of recessions by socializing private debt. When public AND private debt reach the point of no return (can't make payments), you get Greek situation.
Blackdragon 2017-03-11 11:22:24
I always follow the money and so I would propose that the reason people still get married is due to the ADVERTISEMENT industry around marriageVery good point.
When men can’t get jobs, due to trade shocks, marriage plummets. Women don’t want to marry jobless losers. But they’ll have kids with them. Out of wedlock births are now 41%.Yep. In those scenarios, the government (in other words, we the taxpayer) becomes a woman's "husband."
Maybe this phenomenon will force men to wake up.I don't think so. If it did, men would have "woken up" quite a while ago.
Nearly 70% are Christian.Correct. False SP reigns supreme, as always.
Any surprises there tmm SP is so strong?Another good point.
Yes, currently about 5% of marriages are non-monogamous. Of those, only 1/3 of that 5% are non-monogamous marriages between 2 straight people, 2/3 of them are with bisexual people. Some are open, some are swingers, some are Mormons. Bisexuals are allowed to fuck their own sex on the side.Please don't pull made-up numbers out of your ass and quote them as if they're truth. If you're trying to make a point, quote real statistics and studies, and link to them, just like I do.
Religion is here to stay, and this SP is not going away.Correct.
As for lifetime employment being gone, America is fucked and is in crisis since 1990-s.Correct again. The USA is headed for collapse. I'll be long gone by then.
Dimwit 2017-03-11 13:46:04
Some statistics is here. http://www.advocate.com/current-issue/2016/1/08/polyamory-numbers The prevalence of bisexual individuals is evident, especially among women.
hey hey 2017-03-12 01:54:26
Reset like Greece? Greece did not reset. They just forced them to put the dust below the carpet. A reset would have been a default and a "fuck off", civil war and complete collapse. This is just a joke that keeps Greece in check and the next 3 generations will never stand on their feet. And frankly i dont see them changing mentality this way, to have a reset. Of course it is their fault, but so is the fault of wealthy countries that kept giving them money.
Darryl E. 2017-03-12 03:02:50
Idk whether loss of lifetime employment is caused by one strong reason, or many reasons such as ever enlarging government, industry regulated out, foreign work. I too noticed kids with divorced parents have none empathy for relationships whatsoever. Doesn't work out? Find someone new. Don't like that behavior? I cheat on him and tell him I cheated so I can get someone else. 3 years together and I find you annoying now? I'll enter a new 2 year relationship. And these things all happen lightning fast. No sulking, no crying, no thinking about why it happened and can I fix it. Who cares at all. They enter a new relationship and cut ties entirely with the old person. In today's new age I think all men provided they are worthy enough should drop every women once she turns 30. Women would get a strong taste of her own medicine for once. Funny cause I believe in lifetime, only everything about the environment has been screaming for ages the opposite of my belief. My own parents wouldn't dare entertain or discuss the thought of mere divorce. I can't. No. Impossible. Was what came out of their mouths. My 55 year old roommate assaulted me. He began shoving me and we shoved. Then he punched me, I was gonna break his head right then. But then my cooler head asked, is it over a girl, over money? No, no. It cause he identifies himself a tough guy when hes nothing but a clown. So I closed my room door locking it and call the cops. He kept pounding it for a fight. Cops came, told him to stay in his room. I told them about it getting physical and him punching my door. Cops said we can't arrest him, or do anything to him unless one of us ends up in the hospital. I was blown away. I didn't know what to say. I thought for sure something will happen to him. NOTHING. Girls living with their changing men on my same street call the cops on their man all the time. He's getting aggressive officer he gave me a little shove. Ok that's domestic abuse, he'll be locked up for a week. Then you can choose to get a restraining order on him so he don't come around no more or he'll be locked up for a month. Me? Restraining order the cops told me cause one of us didn't end up with brain trauma or broken bones, it's not possible. The only thing I can do is file a 60 days landlord NOTICE to this 55 yr old. After which a eviction letter can begin. And he can delay and fight the eviction letter in court. Needless to say the fuc is still banging and making a scene in this rental house. And all I can do is wait for the 60 day notice to take effect. Sick of laws that favor women in everything.
axldpir 2017-03-13 06:27:20
This is great post, loved it! Similar subject is nutrition. Low fat trend is still holding on for decades, although it has been proved many times that sugar (and excessive carbs) is much worse. Some things need very long time.
Tom 2017-03-13 07:18:37
Men have always been seen as a ''utility'' or ''sacrificial'' for the family/woman. If you are not sacrificial to the family, you're not a REAL man. And then. How about men themselves. We're often not allowed to speak about our wants in the public as it could be label as sexist. Hence, I went MGTOW. It's not I hate women (had been going through the 'grief' cycle, again & again...), it's part of accepting of who & how male & female nature works. We're NOT meant to be the same biologically, spiritually, physically. But a more fortunate thing is I found out these things before I'm 30 (i'm 25 this year), haven't got into ANY long term relationship, while seeing the sorrow, tiredness in my beta dad's eyes with the irritating, demanding mom in a TMM. I have been awakening up!
Jack Outside the Box 2017-03-13 15:16:13
Doesn’t work out? Find someone new.If it doesn't work out, then you should find someone new. Being forced to stay imprisoned to one person is cruel and dehumanizing.
Don’t like that behavior? I cheat on him and tell him I cheated so I can get someone else.Sounds good to me.
3 years together and I find you annoying now? I’ll enter a new 2 year relationship.Why not? Why would you want to stay with someone who finds you annoying?
And these things all happen lightning fast. No sulking, no crying, no thinking about why it happened and can I fix it. Who cares at all. They enter a new relationship and cut ties entirely with the old person.That's actually very healthy. It's called having an abundance mentality.
In today’s new age I think all men provided they are worthy enough should drop every women once she turns 30.That makes no sense at all.
Women would get a strong taste of her own medicine for once.If you don't want women to dump you when they're no longer attracted to you, what would you rather have them do instead? Force themselves to have sex with you, even if they have lost all attraction?
Funny cause I believe in lifetime,Why?
only everything about the environment has been screaming for ages the opposite of my belief.Then why do you believe in it?
My own parents wouldn’t dare entertain or discuss the thought of mere divorce. I can’t. No. Impossible. Was what came out of their mouths.That's very sad. Their brainwashing must have really robbed them of their long term happiness.
Jack Outside the Box 2017-03-13 15:22:10
Hence, I went MGTOW.Are you saying you are celibate now and will never have sex with a woman? If so, that is a pathetic type of surrender. You're feeding into the misandric desires of radical feminists and lesbian separatists. Why not create a non-traditional sexual lifestyle for yourself, like the rest of us here? That way, you can stick it to the tradcons AND man-hating feminists at the same time!
It’s not I hate women (had been going through the ‘grief’ cycle, again & again…),That's why you need to dump monogamy.
it’s part of accepting of who & how male & female nature works. We’re NOT meant to be the same biologically, spiritually, physically.This doesn't justify celibacy.
But a more fortunate thing is I found out these things before I’m 30 (i’m 25 this year), haven’t got into ANY long term relationship, while seeing the sorrow, tiredness in my beta dad’s eyes with the irritating, demanding mom in a TMM. I have been awakening up!But why are you living in a "traditional or nothing" world? There are other options.
Rohan 2017-03-19 05:15:21
I play in a wedding band and attend about 50 weddings per year based in Australia. Can confirm that almost all groom's expect the marriage to last forever and are going into it with Disney fantasies. Brides are more concerned about keeping on time with the run sheet.
Anthony 2017-03-19 15:26:37
This article made me cringe because I met too many privates during basic training (Army) who want to get married.
Tim 2017-03-22 23:57:09
Learned the hard way, here. Still cringe when I look back at how naive, gullible, brainwashed and foolish I used to be. If it weren't for the newly birthed MGTOW folks I stumbled upon during divorce, I'd have (a) committed suicide or (b) ended up repeating the same mistake over again with another woman. Had I learned of them before divorce, I would have labeled the MGTOW crowd annoying, bitter cowards, which makes me glad I didn't learn of them till after the axe swung in my own life. Would have had to feel stupid about that, too. MGTOW saved me from Darwin. Back then, the MGTOWs were a slowly burgeoning, defiant offshoot of the MRAs and hadn't yet fully established themselves as heretics - so I participated in the evolution of their, now our, endeavor. Have been single for several years and am the happiest I've ever been when compared to all my decades prior. Dang near choked on the bitterness of the Red Pill when starting off however. Oh that Red Pill rage. Where once I thought being in a relationship was paramount, I now have frequent nightmares about such a scenario ever recurring. Am talking bout a deep subconscious fear of ever again losing my sovereignty, playing out over and over in my noggin each and every night. Tis why I'm now posting in the wee hours of this morning. Startled up from the nightmare, again. No longer do I fear (in my waking hours) someone pulling the rug out from under me in the future or finding decades of my hard earned savings one day gone. It's an incredibly comforting thing. Should become a priest in retirement, for I truly have grown to love and appreciate celibacy and its many wonderful and hidden blessings. Never thought I'd get to a point in life that I preferred, nay jealously guarded, my celibacy (my precious). Great article. Blessings to all.
Digs J 2017-03-23 22:08:29
The best thing to do is go to a more traditional country with more conservative women.... and just shack up with them. http://www.worldtinderwomen.com/tinder-girls-saigon-vietnam-bikini-swimsuits/